Blowing snow with the PK and the Case snowcaster

A fella I know on a tractor site I’m on, just got one of those k361 engines and is looking at things. Valve seats are good he says. His trouble is the valve guides. So he’s lookin into making new guides. They had trouble with the guides to. Apparently. ?

Noel
 
the flaw with the 361 is the head.... the metal gets too thin in between the exhaust valve and the port so that area contracts/expands more than the rest of the head... which loosens the valve seat... and it began the first time the engine was fired. Put a new billet head on it with a 30 over piston and you got a real nice motor tho.
 
Lance Skene said:
the flaw with the 361 is the head.... the metal gets too thin in between the exhaust valve and the port so that area contracts/expands more than the rest of the head... which loosens the valve seat... and it began the first time the engine was fired. Put a new billet head on it with a 30 over piston and you got a real nice motor tho.
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So they are fixable then. Now because I am limited in knowledge, I have to ask. What is a billet head. And where do you get one.?


Noel
 
a billet head is a solid piece of aluminum that has been milled into a head and would have to come from custom engine shop.... and some local lawn and garden shops might have connections to order them but not likely keep them in stock.... they are also available for the 241 thru 341 blocks aswell to increase compression for a puller tractor but thats not needed for a yard tractor... you can just plane the oem head to get a fresh new surface and use a thin copper gasket.. that will also raise the compression.
 
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Propane1 said:
How long were these k361 engines made ?


Noel
Click to expand...
Not positive for all production but they were used in the Power king tractors from 1979 thru 1984, so that is 6 years. They were used in Simplicity/ Allis GT's, and maybe others. They are a smooth running with good power and torque. There are a number of reasons for the problems they had and the problem was they dropped valve seats. One of the reason (maybe the main one) technology at the time, dropping valve seat is not a Kohler problem only the OHV Tecumseh had the same problem, Over heating of the cylinder head caused the seats to drop this was, over heating had a number of causes 1 the cooling fins were somewhat limited do to the OHV assy, 2 the first gaskets between the head and the valve assy were not good and let oil leak onto the head and cooling fins baking on a build up of burnt oil this really reduced cooling 3 grass and other debris would stick to the oil and further reduce the cooling even the cylinder barrel fins. Another but nearly as serious is that the valve lash seems to need to be watched closer .
The need for more maintenance is required to keep the engine going one is don't let it leak oil all over the head and cylinder, 2 clean the cooling fins head & cylinder regularly keep all the factory cooling tines in place also these heads have a steel insert in the exhaust port its required some guys that like vertical exhausts remove them or don't know what it is and remove them when replacing mufflers etc.
Now as for repairs these heads are easily repaired by a good automotive machine shop ( a billet head is not needed in fact they are for pullers not every day use), auto machines now have the means to repair these as its not a problem for only small air cooled engines many car engine had the same problems when mfg started using alum for heads so machine shop have seen and know this valve seat problem.
Some guys change the seats to bronze and they will hold but I'm don't know about the longevity of a bronze seat for everyday use.
And lastly the problem now is there are no new heads available and some heads are damaged to the point they can not be repaired so finding a replacement head can be hard and expensive
Hope this helps clear up some of the misconceptions about the K361 if maintained its as good an engine as any of the K series
 
MNGB said:
Not positive for all production but they were used in the Power king tractors from 1979 thru 1984, so that is 6 years. They were used in Simplicity/ Allis GT's, and maybe others. They are a smooth running with good power and torque. There are a number of reasons for the problems they had and the problem was they dropped valve seats. One of the reason (maybe the main one) technology at the time, dropping valve seat is not a Kohler problem only the OHV Tecumseh had the same problem, Over heating of the cylinder head caused the seats to drop this was, over heating had a number of causes 1 the cooling fins were somewhat limited do to the OHV assy, 2 the first gaskets between the head and the valve assy were not good and let oil leak onto the head and cooling fins baking on a build up of burnt oil this really reduced cooling 3 grass and other debris would stick to the oil and further reduce the cooling even the cylinder barrel fins. Another but nearly as serious is that the valve lash seems to need to be watched closer .
The need for more maintenance is required to keep the engine going one is don't let it leak oil all over the head and cylinder, 2 clean the cooling fins head & cylinder regularly keep all the factory cooling tines in place also these heads have a steel insert in the exhaust port its required some guys that like vertical exhausts remove them or don't know what it is and remove them when replacing mufflers etc.
Now as for repairs these heads are easily repaired by a good automotive machine shop ( a billet head is not needed in fact they are for pullers not every day use), auto machines now have the means to repair these as its not a problem for only small air cooled engines many car engine had the same problems when mfg started using alum for heads so machine shop have seen and know this valve seat problem.
Some guys change the seats to bronze and they will hold but I'm don't know about the longevity of a bronze seat for everyday use.
And lastly the problem now is there are no new heads available and some heads are damaged to the point they can not be repaired so finding a replacement head can be hard and expensive
Hope this helps clear up some of the misconceptions about the K361 if maintained its as good an engine as any of the K series
Click to expand...

Thanks Gary. Great read.

Noel
 
Propane1 said:
Kohler K361’s were also used in early Ariens GT 18 garden tractors, 1979 to 1987, before they changed to twin M18 hp kohler motors, 1988 to 1991.

Noel
Click to expand...
Thanks Noel so it looks like an eight year production run, and bet 87 was the last year and the M18 replaced it. I knew other makers used the engine I'm not sure if Bolens did or not I know they used the Tecumseh OHV engines
 
Kinda strange there was not a recall on them, like the kohler k17 series one engines that John Deere had in the 317 tractors. I don’t know all the details about that, so I could be off a bit on it.
I also wonder if 1987 or so was the last year of any kohler k series engines built. Not just the k361. I have a 1987 k301.

Noel
 
Was into the shop yesterday afternoon and dug out 2 walk behind snowblowers one is a Toro single stage with a 3.5 hp 2 stroke' my son gave it to me 5/6 years ago I was going to get it going and sell it but never got around to it. The other one is an old Wheelhorse 2 stage 24" with a 7 hp Tecumseh both been sitting in the shed for about 8 years. Tried the Toro first plugged in the power cord and pushed the starter button cranked and crack no start I kind of figured that would be the deal. So I turned my attention to the Wheelhorse plugged it in checked the gas tank turned on the fuel valve added choke and it started up and ran nice, back in 2014 when I had worked on it and got it running I used it a couple of time then in the spring I added Sea Foam to the gas and turned the valve off, I'm a believer in Sea Foam. Anyway ran it out and gave it a go in the snow in front of the shop door worked like a charm for a 2 stage it does throw very far but it never stopped either went thru snow that was over 2' ft deep Its kind of nice to use it to get real close to the doors etc.
Then back to the Toro single stage the darn things are completely enclosed you can't see the engine carb or spark plug, looking it over I seen 3 screws holding the control panel on removed them moved the panel away and I could see the carb and air inlet so I shot some carb cleaner it and pushed the starter button after a couple of revolutions it fired up and died as soon as the cleaner was gone got my gas squirt bottle gave it a shot of gas it started ran for a bit stopped another shot of gas it started again ran a bit longer exhaust smelled terrible like old bad gas (I had added new gas to the gas tank along with Sea Foam) another shot of gas it started ran started to die caught ran started to die caught again and stayed running. Let it run for about 10+ minutes shut it off reinstalled the panel tried starting it again and it fired right off. So out the door to see if it would move snow and it did bit not very far like about 5-6 ft but I think I'm going to try it out here at the house to clean off the deck and due the ramp which is 60' long only has to get the snow off the ramp that is 5' wide so it should work
 
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